I would really rather that these were actual examples, and not conspiracy theories. We all have our own unsubstantiated ideas about what shadowy no-gooders are doing, but I’d rather hear about things that are actually happening.

  • SexMachineStalin [comrade/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
    4114·
    11 months ago

    Literally anything regarding China, especially Xinjiang if you talk to anyone from international-community-1international-community-2

    I was talking to a mate about Palestine and he immediately went for the “bUt TiAnAm3n SqU@r3 k1LLeD oVeR tEn Th0uSaNd” and the “Ch1n@ cEnOcIde iN UygHuRs Th0” with the swiftness of a 737 flying into the 2nd tower. They will disregard who originally makes these claims and are 100% unfazed by say, World Uyghur Congress being totally in support of the genocide in Gaza, the response being either dismissal or “you’re too much into politics and also ableism”.

      • Alsephina@lemmy.mlEnglish
        102·
        11 months ago

        China’s bottom-up system of power starting at the mass line via committees and polling does mean a slower progress on social change than a top-down approach like you see in the west, but it also means a more consistent gradual improvement as younger generations age up. Whereas it’s always a constant battle in the west, with a large (quite often successful) push for reversal.

        Trans rights got a boost in China just last week for example with a court ruling.

      • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
        147·
        11 months ago

        Since 2020 China literally has more workplace protections for trans people than the US

        https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.scmp.com/news/people-culture/gender-diversity/article/3243608/blessing-china-court-lauds-rule-law-backs-transgender-staffer-fired-being-absent-while-leave

        Don’t pinkwash your redscare.

        Also Xi isn’t a dictator. He was literally elected by a democratic assembly. Also he historically pushes for more democracy in China, more than the US. Literally look into the idea of whole process people’s democracy

        “The most basic criterion for democracy is whether people have the right to participate extensively in national governance, whether people’s demands can be responded to and satisfied. In China, the people participate in the management of state affairs, social affairs, and economic and cultural affairs; they provide opinions and suggestions for the design of national development plans at the highest level and also contribute to the governance of local public affairs; they take part in democratic elections, consultations, decision-making, management, and oversight…"

        https://www.peoplesworld.org/article/whole-process-peoples-democracy-in-china-what-does-it-mean/

        • HakFoo@lemmy.sdf.org
          91·
          11 months ago

          The West seems to define “democracy” in a very specific form: there MUST be multiple competing political parties and power MUST, at least in theory (compare Singapore, Mexico, etc) regularly transfer between them as the result of elections.

          This is something Western states have been able to pull off, but it’s actually sort of peripheral to the theoretical INTENT of democracy-- that the government serves the masses. Good governance is pretty much a by-product of the fear of being voted out of office.

          You can, and often do, have the all-sacred elections and peaceful transfer of power and still have a government which isn’t acting in service of its electorate. Sure, you can pick red corporate stooge or blue corporate stooge, but the Overton window is still a narrow slit that represents no real threat to the rich, and factionalism and winner-take-all elections sabotage any actual forward motion.

          Meanwhile, the single-party state, unencumbered by having to tear itself apart in battles for the throne every four years, can focus on consensus and actual needs. Good governance can come from a sense of civic duty, or even a smartly weaponized corruption (if everyone thrives, my cut of graft grows with it!)

        • Syldon@feddit.ukEnglish
          312·
          11 months ago

          Since 2020 China literally has more workplace protections for trans people than the US

          So does this mean China has better protection ? This is not a valid comment unless they are both starting from the same point.

          Also Xi isn’t a dictator. He was literally elected by a democratic assembly.

          Adolf Hitler was elected, as was Putin. All are essentially the sole control of their countries. Being a dictator is not summarised by the method you gain power; it is what you do with that power after it obtained.

          • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
            104·
            11 months ago

            So does this mean China has better protection ? This is not a valid comment unless they are both starting from the same point.

            China’s courts hold transphobic firings to be illegal. In the US similar protections generally don’t exist, and where they do, they actually don’t because of at will employment law.

            Adolf Hitler was elected.

            He was not elected, he was appointed to his position. You should speak with less confidence on this subject until you can get basic facts right.

            as was Putin.

            Putin won a bourgeois election. Also putin isn’t a dictator, he is the executive officer of a capitalist oligarchy.

            All are essentially the sole control of their countries. Being a dictator is not summarised by the method you gain power; it is what you do with that power after it obtained.

            No, being a dictator means you aren’t accountable to other political power structures. Xi can be instantly recalled by the constituent assembly if they want. The constituent assembly is made of representatives sent by local democratic councils.

            • Syldon@feddit.ukEnglish
              27·
              11 months ago

              Hitler’s party was elected in, much like the UK prime minister is not actually elected. Hitler still had to win a seat in the Reichstag, so…

              Putin is a dictator. No one is allowed to stand against him. In the current election the 29 candidates who have tried to stand have had that right taken away from them for one reason or another. Putin has the final say on what goes on in Russia. Putin and Xi may have the illusion of being recalled, but it will not happen. Anyone who thinks otherwise is either spouting propaganda or one very gullible individual.

              I can easily believe that the GOP are creating problem for the LBGQT community, but they are soon to be ousted from any power they posses. Many of the gerrymandering that has gone on has been reversed or will be in time for the next elections. In NY state alone this will be enough to overturn the lead the GOP has on blocking legislation.

              As for the “at will employment” law China has exactly the same thing.

              The reasons for dismissal with prior notice, which are not attributable to the faults of the employee, include incompetence even after training or a transfer of position, non-work-related illness, and a change in the objective circumstances on which the labour contract was originally concluded.

              Where the incompetance is discretionary then there is little an employee can do to protect himself.

              The USA has National anti discrimination laws, China has no discriminatory laws, but also has nothing to protect an individual.

              So your idea that China is a better place to be doesn’t really hold water in my opinion. Yes, there are some republican states that are making things hard, but this is a very short lived episode in US politics imo.

              • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
                74·
                11 months ago

                Hitler’s party was elected in, much like the UK prime minister is not actually elected. Hitler still had to win a seat in the Reichstag, so…

                The UK prime Minister is also appointed lol.

                Putin is a dictator. No one is allowed to stand against him. In the current election the 29 candidates who have tried to stand have had that right taken away from them for one reason or another. Putin has the final say on what goes on in Russia. Putin and Xi may have the illusion of being recalled, but it will not happen. Anyone who thinks otherwise is either spouting propaganda or one very gullible individual.

                Notice how you didn’t include any evidence of Xi being a dictator

                I can easily believe that the GOP are creating problem for the LBGQT community, but they are soon to be ousted from any power they posses. Many of the gerrymandering that has gone on has been reversed or will be in time for the next elections. In NY state alone this will be enough to overturn the lead the GOP has on blocking legislation.

                Lol

                As for the “at will employment” law China has exactly the same thing.

                From your own link

                Employees can only be dismissed if one of the statutory reasons for termination is fulfilled. This means that an employer cannot dismiss an employee at will.

                Proving incompetence is a higher bar than at will employment actually

                The USA has National anti discrimination laws, China has no discriminatory laws, but also has nothing to protect an individual.

                They materially don’t.

                So your idea that China is a better place to be doesn’t really hold water in my opinion.

                China isnt involved in carrying out a genocide rn, and China hasn’t destabilized the middle east through mass violence. China is better.

                • Syldon@feddit.ukEnglish
                  25·
                  11 months ago

                  Notice how you didn’t include any evidence of Xi being a dictator

                  Aside from the fact that no one is allowed to run for elections unless they have party approval. China doesn’t even try to hide that there is no real democracy there.

                  Proving incompetence is a higher bar than at will employment actually

                  Subjective.

                  They materially don’t.

                  Again subjective.

                  China isnt involved in carrying out a genocide rn, and China hasn’t destabilized the middle east through mass violence. China is better.

                  Come on. Uighurs must surely count as human beings. That is just plain wrong man.

                  • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
                    44·
                    11 months ago

                    Aside from the fact that no one is allowed to run for elections unless they have party approval. China doesn’t even try to hide that there is no real democracy there.

                    1. They literally have 9 parties
                    2. if one political party had 95 percent approval rating(based on western polling, the cpc does) it is reasonable that there is one major party and 8 minor parties

                    Come on. Uighurs must surely count as human beings. That is just plain wrong man.

                    That propaganda:

                    A) is being spread by adrien zenz, a nazi paid by a cia front group to spread shit, who claims God gave him a personal mission to destroy china

                    B) is old news that was abandoned when the area opened up for tourism again, and there were magically no camps

                    C) isn’t believed by basically every Muslim country on earth who sent delegations to see what was going on, meanwhile the US which cares so much about Muslims it is enabling genocide against muslims as we speak thought it is happening before they walked it back. Give me a break.

      • TacoButtPlug@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        25·
        11 months ago

        My instance defederated from them… but here we are. Can’t wait for lemmy to catch up and let us block instances on an individual level.

        edit: Awww Hexbear didn’t like that. Sadly my instance won’t let me block you assholes yet. Gonna have to deal longer than any of us likes.