Seems like an interesting effort. A developer is building an alternative Java-based backend to Lemmy’s Rust-based one, with the goal of building in a handful of different features. The dev is looking at using this compatibility to migrate their instance over to the new platform, while allowing the community to use their apps of choice.
I have higher hopes. Java is three times more developers than Rust (https://www.statista.com/statistics/793628/worldwide-developer-survey-most-used-languages/), and you can see in this thread a number of people saying they could contribute as they know Java and not Rust.
Let’s hope for the best.
Java is a corporate language that most devs hate. Rust (Lemmy) is more popular as a hobby language that devs enjoy hacking in for fun.
Hm, Java is hated by devs, but still 2nd language on GitHub with 11,7% of the total code hosted, while Rust is number 13 with 1,8%?
https://madnight.github.io/githut/#/pull_requests/2023/4
How much of that 11.7% is 35-character class names?
I’m only half joking.
It’s by amount of pull requests, so the length of class names and other Java boilerplate doesn’t count.
Stockholm syndrome.
And even more, the Lemmy codebase doesn’t really have any important developers besides the two main devs: https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy/graphs/contributors.
Even looking at the contributions to something like Mbin, which has been around for much shorter, you already see 6 people with more than 50 commits, while Lemmy has one
https://github.com/MbinOrg/mbin/graphs/contributors
We have 13 contributors with Sublinks so far. I expect more will come after the announcement.
Java devs like you need to step away from the PC and stop assaulting the world with a terrible language. You should be ashamed of yourselves for inflicting decades of misery on the world.
Java will go the way of COBOL. The future is Nim.
You’re delusional if you believe people care about Nim. It has been around for 16 years and is still nothing in comparison to Java. Java won’t go anywhere and is here to stay.
Or, bare with me…it’s just a it o banter my son.
Or, bare with me… It’s being a wanker
I don’t like Java either, but there’s no need to insult the developers for using a language they like.
Thank you
Who, who whooooooooooo dyou think you are?
Your mom, probably
— Your mom, probably
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Who, who whooooooooooo dyou think you are?
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I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
“I’m right, and if anyone disagrees, it’s because they’re brainwashed”
There’s literally no possible way to argue against this type of logic.
The weight of my intellect is a heavy burden to bear.
Irrelevant
Typical Java dev attitude.
Thanks but I’m a network engineer, I’m just saying your argument is pointless, the majority of devs support a certain language. How they or you feel about it doesn’t matter one bit.
Removed by mod
Let me guess, every time a user breaks your app you blame the network don’t you? Typical dev.
typical gatekeeper attitude
That’s bullshit, frankly
Citation required, because strangely enough people whom I hear about complaining about Java never seem to be the good developers but the ones I wouldn’t hire
As a java dev, I can say that we hate working with java and love working with java at the same time.
Ah, an anime consumer. Explain to me why FMA:B is the greatest anime ever made?
fmab is another regular anime that’s overshilled.
Jesus H Christ.
Just peeking at the source code and it all looks like pretty standard stuff. Looks just like apps I’ve worked on at several jobs.
Is it sexy? No. But a lot of people have experience with this and could help develop.
Only time will tell if this project pays off though
I’m pretty sure Nutomic was a Java dev before starting work on Lemmy and learning Rust from scratch. That by itself should already speak volumes.
One-Up projects like this rarely ever turn out well, that’s from my own experiences. Even though this isn’t a popular view, I still think I’m right on this one, we can circle back in say, 6 months, to see if my predictions are right.
That is true, I used to be an Android developer and then learned Rust by writing code for Lemmy. Are you by any chance my new stalker?
And if we’re comparing the languages, the fact alone that there are no Nullpointerexceptions makes Rust infinitely better than Java for me. I also agree that this sort of copycat project will soon be forgotten. For example have you ever heard of Rustodon?
No, it was on that AMA you guys did months ago, and I remember things about people.
Very impressive! The only thing I can remember well are places.
what’s wrong with having null pointer exception?
Null is terrible.
A lot of languages have it available as a valid return value for most things, implicitly. This also means you have to do extra checking or something like this will blow up with an exception:
// java example // can throw exception String address = person.getAddress().toUpperCase(); // safe String address = ""; if (person.getAddress() != null) { person.getAddress().toUpperCase(); }
There are a ton of solutions out there. Many languages have added null-coalescing and null-conditional operators – which are a shorthand for things like the above solutions. Some languages have removed the implicit nulls (like Kotlin), requiring them to be explicitly marked in their type. Some languages have a wrapper around nullable values, an Option type. Some languages remove null entirely from the language (I believe Rust falls into this, using an option type in place of).
Not having null isn’t particularly common yet, and isn’t something languages can just change due to breaking backwards compatibility. However, languages have been adding features over time to make nulls less painful, and most have some subset of the above as options to help.
I do think Option types are fantastic solutions, making you deal with the issue that a none/empty type can exist in a particular place. Java has had them for basically 10 years now (since Java 8).
// optional example Class Person { private String address; //prefer this if a null could ever be returned public Optional getAddress() { return Optional.ofNullable(address); } // not this public String getAddress() { return address; }
When consuming, it makes you have to handle the null case, which you can do a variety of ways.
// set a default String address = person.getAddress().orElse("default value"); // explicitly throw an exception instead of an implicit NullPointerException as before String address = person.getAddress().orElseThrow(SomeException::new); // use in a closure only if it exists person.getAddress().ifPresent(addr -> logger.debug("Address {}", addr)); // first example, map to modify, and returning default if no value String address = person.getAddress().map(String::toUpperCase).orElse("");
I also was a professional java dev, and also had to use spring boot in most corporate environments.
I don’t wanna knock anyone’s re-write, because I know how difficult it is to dissuade someone when they’re excited about a project. But to me, starting a new project or doing a rewrite, is the best opportunity to learn a newer, better language. We taught ourself Rust by coding lemmy, and I recently learned Kotlin / jetpack compose because I wanted to learn android development. Learning new languages is not an issue for most programmers; we have to learn new frameworks and languages every year or so if we want to keep up.
This is potentially hundreds of hours of wasted time that could be spent on other things. Even if someone absolutely hates Rust and doesn’t want to contribute to the massive amount of open issues on Lemmy, there are still a lot of front-ends that could use more contributors.
it it common to announce a ‘major rewrite’ without having it complete?
i mean, at the moment, theres little to discern it from lemmy at the moment… why make a big public proclamation about it before you even touch the front end?
To get contributors to the backend?
i guess. i would think there are better avenues looking for devs though